> Matthias Hofmann <hofmann@anvil-soft.com> writes:
> > I see. But when does a name or declaration have namespace scope? In
other
> > words, is it possible for a name to be available in the global
namespace
> > without having namespace scope?

Llewelly wrote:
> I really doubt that's possible. If you're interested, the relevant
std
>     sections are 3.3 and 3.4 .

It's possible. Macro names are available in the global namespace -- and
all
other namespaces. (That's why they're considered evil.)


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Matthias Hofmann wrote:
> "Llewelly" <llewelly.at@xmission.dot.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:86sm1nwvta.fsf@zorthluthik.foo.bar...
..
> I would be glad if someone could clarify this for me, too. I got no
idea
> what a "name of namespace scope in the gloabal namespace" is supposed
to
> mean, which makes it even harder for me to understand. How can a name
of
> namespace scope be in the global namespace?

The global namespace is, as it's name implies, a namespace. Therefore,
when a declaration has namespace scope, and it's not inside any other
namespace, then the namespace that defines it's scope is the global
namespace.


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Matthias Hofmann <hofmann@anvil-soft.com> writes:

> "Llewelly" <llewelly.at@xmission.dot.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:86sm1nwvta.fsf@zorthluthik.foo.bar...
> >
>
> [snip]
>
> >
> > What about 17.4.3.1.3/5:
> >
> >      # Each function signature from the Standard C library declared
> >      # with external linkage is reserved to the implementation for use
> >      # as a function signature with both extern "C" and extern "C++"
> >      # linkage,168) or as a name of namespace scope in the global
> >      # namespace.
> >
> > In the past I've interpreted this as granting library implementators
> >      permission provide a function definition for names such as
> > ::toupper(), regardless of whether <cxxx> or <xxx.h> was included
> >      at all. Yet I can't imagine someone opening issue 456 if that was
> >      the case. So I don't understand it at all, it seems.
> >
> > What does 17.4.3.1.3/5 mean?
>
> I would be glad if someone could clarify this for me, too. I got no idea
> what a "name of namespace scope in the gloabal namespace" is supposed to
> mean, which makes it even harder for me to understand. How can a name of
> namespace scope be in the global namespace?

I don't think this clears up the issue of whether or not 17.4..3.1.3/5
    allows library implementators to leave C library names in the
    global namespace, but it seems to me what 'name of namespace scope
    in the global namespace' is supposed to mean is cleared up by
    3.3.5/3 :

    # The outermost declarative region of a translation unit is also a
    # namespace, called the global namespace. A name declared in the
    # global namespace has global namespace scope (also called global
    # scope). The potential scope of such a name begins at its point
    # of declaration (3.3.1) and ends at the end of the translation
    # unit that is its declarative region. Names with global namespace
    # scope are said to be global.

The global scope is a namespace, though an implicit one, and the
    phrase you question is thus not the contradiction it might
    otherwise seem.

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Matthias Hofmann wrote:
>=20
> I would be glad if someone could clarify this for me, too. I got no ide=
a
> what a "name of namespace scope in the global namespace" is supposed to
> mean, which makes it even harder for me to understand. How can a name o=
f
> namespace scope be in the global namespace?
>=20

=A73.3.5/3: "The outermost declarative region of a translation unit is
also a namespace, called the global namespace. A name declared in the
global namespace has global namespace scope (also called global scope).
[...]"

That said, the sentence "name of namespace scope in the global
namespace" has a clear and unambiguous meaning to me. Sure, one may
wonder why such wording was chosen over the less redundant and
equivalent "name of global namespace scope", but I don't think it
deserves a DR for just that.

Alberto

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<kuyper@wizard.net> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:1114387759.297461.266510@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

> The global namespace is, as it's name implies, a namespace. Therefore,
> when a declaration has namespace scope, and it's not inside any other
> namespace, then the namespace that defines it's scope is the global
> namespace.

I see. But when does a name or declaration have namespace scope? In other
words, is it possible for a name to be available in the global namespace
without having namespace scope?

--
Matthias Hofmann
Anvil-Soft, CEO
http://www.anvil-soft.com - The Creators of Klomanager
http://www.anvil-soft.de - Die Macher des Klomanagers




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Matthias Hofmann <hofmann@anvil-soft.com> writes:

> <kuyper@wizard.net> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:1114387759.297461.266510@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
>
> > The global namespace is, as it's name implies, a namespace. Therefore,
> > when a declaration has namespace scope, and it's not inside any other
> > namespace, then the namespace that defines it's scope is the global
> > namespace.
>
> I see. But when does a name or declaration have namespace scope? In other
> words, is it possible for a name to be available in the global namespace
> without having namespace scope?

I really doubt that's possible. If you're interested, the relevant std
    sections are 3.3 and 3.4 .


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Pete Becker <petebecker@acm.org> writes:

> Matthias Hofmann wrote:
>
>> I am a little confused about toupper(). The way I interpret the standard,
>> including the header <cctype> should make toupper() available within
>> namespace std, and only within namespace std.
>
> That's what the standard says. It's often not reasonable to implement.
> There's an active defect report that's designed to relax this
> requirement to match common behavior.
[snip]

What about 17.4.3.1.3/5:

     # Each function signature from the Standard C library declared
     # with external linkage is reserved to the implementation for use
     # as a function signature with both extern "C" and extern "C++"
     # linkage,168) or as a name of namespace scope in the global
     # namespace.

In the past I've interpreted this as granting library implementators
     permission provide a function definition for names such as
::toupper(), regardless of whether <cxxx> or <xxx.h> was included
     at all. Yet I can't imagine someone opening issue 456 if that was
     the case. So I don't understand it at all, it seems.

What does 17.4.3.1.3/5 mean?








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"Llewelly" <llewelly.at@xmission.dot.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:86sm1nwvta.fsf@zorthluthik.foo.bar...
>

[snip]

>
> What about 17.4.3.1.3/5:
>
>      # Each function signature from the Standard C library declared
>      # with external linkage is reserved to the implementation for use
>      # as a function signature with both extern "C" and extern "C++"
>      # linkage,168) or as a name of namespace scope in the global
>      # namespace.
>
> In the past I've interpreted this as granting library implementators
>      permission provide a function definition for names such as
> ::toupper(), regardless of whether <cxxx> or <xxx.h> was included
>      at all. Yet I can't imagine someone opening issue 456 if that was
>      the case. So I don't understand it at all, it seems.
>
> What does 17.4.3.1.3/5 mean?

I would be glad if someone could clarify this for me, too. I got no idea
what a "name of namespace scope in the gloabal namespace" is supposed to
mean, which makes it even harder for me to understand. How can a name of
namespace scope be in the global namespace?

--
Matthias Hofmann
Anvil-Soft, CEO
http://www.anvil-soft.com - The Creators of Klomanager
http://www.anvil-soft.de - Die Macher des Klomanagers




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