>>>>> clamage@taumet.eng.sun.com (Steve Clamage):

> If that still isn't good enough, you can get a paper copy of any
> current draft, warts and all, from X3 for the cost of duplication
> and mailing.  What sort of access do you feel you are being denied?

The ability to access the current draft, warts and all,
electronically, and optionally printing it out, bearing the costs of
retrieving and printing it out myself.

I don't really see difference between the two, and the latter could be
done without much administration on the part of the commitee.  I'll
lend you server space for http, and anonymous ftp, if that's the
problem (though I don't imagine it would be).


- Steinar


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In article <whenka7q50.fsf_-_@norne.metis.no> Steinar Bang
<sb@norne.metis.no> writes:

|> >>>>> clamage@taumet.eng.sun.com (Steve Clamage):

|> > If that still isn't good enough, you can get a paper copy of any
|> > current draft, warts and all, from X3 for the cost of duplication
|> > and mailing.  What sort of access do you feel you are being denied?

|> The ability to access the current draft, warts and all,
|> electronically, and optionally printing it out, bearing the costs of
|> retrieving and printing it out myself.

|> I don't really see difference between the two,

Legal issues.  There are copyright problems involved with the draft; I
don't understand them completely, but roughly speaking, ANSI has a set
of rules, and they must be abided by.

|> and the latter could be
|> done without much administration on the part of the commitee.  I'll
|> lend you server space for http, and anonymous ftp, if that's the
|> problem (though I don't imagine it would be).

The latest versions were available for a while at Cygnus.  They were
withdrawn because of the copyright issues, and a request from either
ANSI or ISO.

I, too, would like for much more to be publicly available.  I think that
a significant number of the committee members also feel this way.  (I
know of some that do.)  But the committee doesn't make ANSI or ISO
rules, and it has to abide by them.

Note, for example, that even once the committee has finished, and the
draft is finalized as an official standard, an online copy will not be
legal.
--
James Kanze         Tel.: (+33) 88 14 49 00        email: kanze@gabi-soft.fr
GABI Software, Sarl., 8 rue des Francs-Bourgeois, F-67000 Strasbourg, France
Conseils,    tudes et r   alisations en logiciel orient    objet --
                -- A la recherche d'une activit    dans une region francophone
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Hi,
Steinar Bang (sb@norne.metis.no) wrote:
: >>>>> clamage@taumet.eng.sun.com (Steve Clamage):

: > If that still isn't good enough, you can get a paper copy of any
: > current draft, warts and all, from X3 for the cost of duplication
: > and mailing.  What sort of access do you feel you are being denied?

: The ability to access the current draft, warts and all,
: electronically, and optionally printing it out, bearing the costs of
: retrieving and printing it out myself.

Note Steve's wording of 'current draft'. He did *NOT* say 'current
[internal] working paper'.  You *HAVE* access to the current draft
electronically: This is the one released in April 1995 and it is
available via ftp from

  ftp://research.att.com/dist/c++std/WP
  ftp://ftp.maths.warwick.ac.uk:/pub/c++/std/WP
  ftp://ftpt.su.edu.au:/pub/C++/CommitteeDraft

(I'm not sure but I think the UK site is the official one).

There is, however, no public access to the current internal version of
the working paper:  This is only avialable to the members of the
standardization committee. How to become a member of the committee
depends on the rules of the national standardization institutes.
--
<mailto:dietmar.kuehl@uni-konstanz.de>
<http://www.informatik.uni-konstanz.de/~kuehl/>
I am a realistic optimist - that's why I appear to be slightly pessimistic
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In article <KANZE.96Sep11132116@slsvijt.lts.sel.alcatel.de>,
James Kanze US/ESC 60/3/141 #40763 <kanze@lts.sel.alcatel.de> wrote:
>Note, for example, that even once the committee has finished, and the
>draft is finalized as an official standard, an online copy will not be
>legal.

You might want to contact Kent Pitman (kmp@harlequin.com), the Document
Editor for X3J13, the ANSI Common Lisp committee.  He managed to get
permission to make an HTML variant of the ANSI Common Lisp specification,
and even to allow (even encourage and facilitate) copying of the entire
HTML hierarchy.

See http://www.harlequin.com/books/HyperSpec/FrontMatter/index.html for the
Common Lisp HyperSpec.
--
Barry Margolin
BBN Planet, Cambridge, MA
barmar@bbnplanet.com -  Phone (617) 873-3126 - Fax (617) 873-6351
(BBN customers, please call (800) 632-7638 option 1 for support)
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